Gybing for lightweights

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Adam1275
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Gybing for lightweights

Postby Adam1275 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 8:54 pm

Hi, i'm new to the class i've sailed a number of times am roughly 64-65 kgs (depending on breakfast) and have k16 which shows the "superman punch" method of gybing, which im sure works fine for most of you. However, I find I can not get it to work in any wind strength, it either ends up in me capsizing or in not being able to head up wuickly enough to get power on to pop battens etc etc. So i was wondering if there were any other lighter weight sailors who have their own methods of gybing. Any comments or suggestions are welcome.

Many thanks Adam :)

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Rick » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:20 pm

I am 73kgs so a bit more than you but I'd suggest the K16/Superman punch is the way to go... you just need to stick at it & practice.

Where do you sail?

Are there any other MPS sailors at your club?
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Adam1275 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:35 pm

I sail at Chichester Yacht Club (hardly ideal for skiffs I know) but im also a member of Lymington Town SC and can also sail at HISC. There is another Musto that comes down on occassion for doing the snowflake and he is also a newbie to the class.
Admittedly i havent been the most avid at sailing it this winter so far but im hoping to do more in the coming weeks.

I was speaking to a guy at Chew Valley the other week and he said he found the Sman punch was a no go for him and that he swaps hands before a gybe and goes straight out on the handle. I've tried it, and the bumps on my legs and the wetness i felt are testament that that method would need plenty of refinement.

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Rick » Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:43 pm

If you have bumps on your legs I guess you are stumbling about a bit or bashing them on the wing/gunwhale.

It's tough to start learning in these temperatures.

After the boom comes over you need the kite pulling ASAP so I really think the S'man punch is key ...

Come to as many opens as possible & see what others do ... people are usually very willing to share thoughts; difficult to dispense much useful advise without seeing what you are doing ...
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Adam1275 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:02 pm

well the bumbs and chilly ness are as i capsize again =S
I had a number of these at the Tiger Trophy which was slightly embarrassing =(

I do tend to find i cant get through to the other side and pull the kite round quickly i simply heel extremely to the new windward side. I might be steering to slowly but when i steer quicker this is when i capsize =S

Hopefully i will be at the opens i'll try to find occassions to sail with other mustos for hints =)

thanks all the same =)

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Rick » Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:05 pm

Are you saying you had these problems in very light winds?

It's easy to topple over when there is no wind in the rig to balance against ....
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Adam1275 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:24 pm

to be honest i have them in any wind. Light winds im well aware that popping battens is a B***h and how theres no support from the rig against your weight (from 29ers) , but even then i capsize from what would be steering to quickly and powering up early . Im hopefully going to be spending the next 2 weekends and maybe some of half term musto sailing so i should get a big chunk of practice in and I will see how it goes. I mainly wanted to see what styles there were out there and to see if people have little mods that might work.

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Rick » Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:26 am

In light winds it can help to use quite a bit of downhaul to help the battens pop ... then roll it and correct the roll as the boom crosses to flip them. Also don't put them in too tight.
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Paul Clements » Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:16 am

I note Adam wants to know more about my alternative gybe for light weights . No doubt you guessed he talked to me at Chew Valley. I can assure you my method works for both light wind roll gybes and in high winds with the main still set. If it goes to plan I seldom capsize.

In essence the technique is very similar to how a lightweight would do a single sail gybe, if bearing away into it while on the wire. It can be practiced single sail with the only difference being single sail you pick up the main sheet in the middle, whereas with the spinnaker up you pick up the new sheet at the block.

I will start the process (it is a process) on starboard full wiring with main nicely set. In anticipation of a gybe I change the sheet lead from having my right arm in front of the trapeze to behind it. If you don't do this the sheet will end up trapped the wrong side of the trapeze so it is essential. It is a bit uncomfortable but perfectly OK to sail like this. As the gybe is imminent I gather up the slack in the lazy sheet and hold the lot in my front hand. Also I may raise the trapeze a bit to make coming in a bit easier without using the handle, but look for maximum speed. Ease the kite and let the boat bear away (it should so don't force it) and step smoothly into the boat using you elbow for balance and to remove the hook. Now the key moment, the old front hand moves behind my back still holding the sheets and grabs the tiller with hand underneath then flicking it up in the air so it will be correctly placed on the new side but not hit the boom (This is the old fashioned way of tacking) . The old tiller hand grabs the new sheet near the block and the old sheets are dropped.. Face the front let the gybe progress (tiller follows rather than force it) and go for the new side in large steps with your eyes glued to the handle. The foil tripping effect allows one to grab that handle from under the boom with the left hand, which also carries the sheet if you remember. When the angle is right (quite hot) stop the turn which, by inertial effect, causes the boom to gybe whereupon you swing out on the handle to the extent required. This can be just a brief trapeze on the gunnel if light winds, to fully out on the rack if windy. Because the sheet hand punches out to the handle you can be confident that the kite will always set and the tug on the handle invariably pops the battens. My old bones don't permit the pelvic thrust and hook on that should now occur.

As described the main is left cleated, which is not ideal. As a refinement the slack in the main sheet main can be carried through, hooked over the old front hands little finger, and never dropped. Don't try that until the gybe is sorted and is muscle memory.

I stress this is for light weights only. Imagine what would happen if Sten hit the wire full trapezing having just finished a gybe. Messy!

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby SELSBowbitch » Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:01 pm

OK, having been coaching these things and sailing them for quite a while I'd agree with Rick. Personally I haven't seen much difference in technique between the light and heavyweights in the gybing sequence.

The no 1 key point is to keep the speed on and use very little helm during the turn.

No 2 make sure you sit on the rack after the gybe, it allows you to be tracking in the right direction with speed and gives you a stable platform to hook on from.

no 3 don't ease the main in light wind gybes and use your bodyweight to steer the boat rather than too much helm, with practice this will force the battens to pop as you get the turn and roll perfect. Use superman technique, it's very controllable.

no 4 as the breeze increases to trapeizing, ease the main a few inches before you gybe, it gives you a little more time after the gybe to sort yourself out (I do mean a few inches, any more and you'll swim!)

no 5 keep watching K16 as it is full or really good advice but bear in mind that Sten is fairly heavy and is a bloody genius at steering (don't ever mention I said that!) The key for you is always to have your weight on the rack after a manoever, you will get faster and end up so slick that you don't need wire to wire.

no6 Prepare well before the gybe, the biggest mistake I have seen is when you don't sort yourself out before you get off the wire.Spend as little time on the hull as possible, you should always be on one rack or the other

A few references:

Good technique www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4KE5JpLYcs
www.youtube.com/watch?v=INa3EZOApEU

Bad Technique (sorry Leigh) www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtzWnEaOi0U
(Sorry Rob) www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHZmUcV5e_A&feature=related


As a point of reference, I haven't seen anyone at the front of the fleet using the handles after the gybe, it overcomplicates things and you would only get it perfect 60% of the time, the other 40% you'll end up swimming. The same reasoning behind why most of the fleet don't even do it on tacks as well.

If you need any more videos, I have about 40 from the QM training which have anything from good, bad to you've been framed, just let me know and I can post them with the QM ones on youtube.

cheers
[color=#0040BF]Graeme

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Paul Clements » Tue Feb 09, 2010 2:23 pm

Graeme is correct in all point, except the 60% comment. I would expect to nail 49 out of 50 gybes unless stupid windy. However I re-iterate the point that this is for lightweights only. My weight(62 Kg) on the rack does not have as much effect as (say) Graeme! I need the option to grab the handle at least briefly while ensuring I have the kite set immediately the gybe completes. Don't change a working technique once it is muscle memory though, is worth saying.

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby paul manning » Tue Feb 09, 2010 7:11 pm

The other point to think about is that it seems good technique to ensure all the slack is taken out of the new sheet from the windward side before you gybe. This then means there is only a long arm length to pull through in a light air gybe.

When we briefly spoke on Sunday, you said you were coming to the Rutland and Stokes Bay opens, so we might be able to help then. Alternatively, have a chat with Russ Clark and see if you can get to one of his Stokes Bay training sessions...
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby 151 » Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:07 pm

Adam,

I am running a training weekend at Stiokes Bay this weekend 13/14 Feb for a max of 10 boats - I have 9 at the moment. Call me if you are interested, a complete mix of abilities will be there but there will be some lightweights too so you can chat about your concerns. Give me a call on the number below.
Russ

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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby Rick » Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:25 pm

Russ ... can we have a bit for the website?

Even if it's full good for people to see what's occurin'
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Re: Gybing for lightweights

Postby bdu98252 » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:15 am

Hi Adam,
As a fellow sub 75kg sailor I can certainly sympathise with your learning process. I too had some issues with this technique and in above around 20knots have to revert to just getting the boom across. I would say that you have to stick with the superman technique as it will see the best consistent gybe results in the long run.

It is harder for the lightweight as they are unable to generate the straight line speed particualrly on flat water that the larger fellow can generate. They then have to be very acurate with their steering to maintain sufficient speed on the exit for the wind to flow accross the main on the new side. My top tip would be to play with the amount of main eased and look at the tell tales on the exit of the gybe. If they are stalled and the boat wants to capsize as opposed to accelerate then you may need more main sheet ease. As you seem to be falling in in all windstrengths then you may need to look at your overall techniques as in under ten knots I don't really need to ease the main at all as long as the speed is maintained.

Cheers John


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